For the moron Neanderthals of the Far Right who will scream its the operators fault and we do not give a shit about marketing more safer designed weapons, if such idiotic polices were followed for other consumer goods today we would not have safety glass, anti-lock breaks, back up safeties, child proof medicine caps and chemical bottles, back up cameras, kick back muzzles on chain saws and the list goes on and on. No the devil went down to Georgia to learn how to play a fiddle. NO, SIG has a problem that they would rather fight in court. Period. The Milwaukee Police Department reports "multiple unexplained accidental discharges" of the Sig Sauer P320 9mm, a gun all officers are required to carry, making for more than 1,600 firearms. Hes talking about trial lawyers recruiting clients whove experienced negligent discharges with P320s and suing the gun manufacturer. Then either the gun somehow managed to magically clear both the broken tab and foreign body to continue to operate. Maybe its a technical issue, maybe its a training issue. And yes, if I pulled some of those stunts, Id have my membership revoked. I also have a manual safety. Good job! As a result, the P320s were withdrawn from service, leaving the JTF-2 with their older P226s. Police Department, was wounded when his P320 duty gun discharged without a trigger pull while he was carrying it in a gym bag wrapped carefully with a cloth. Officer Collette was wounded in his left leg. When Villani was asked for his opinion of SIG Sauer, he said, I carry SIGs, I own SIGs, I just dont own a 320nor would I ever. When Scott asked Villani what he found when he took a P320 apart, he said, I thought Wow, they need to do their homework, they need to fix this gun.. It provides another example of how the gun free zone purportedly keeps people safe by not only keeping guns away, but by requiring more discharges nearby. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0LUbLu6TqA, Simply put, the P320 is not safe and the lawsuits arent frivolous. The clearest memory I have about the many people experiencing post-upgrade discharges is a cop who set his P320 on a table, and several seconds after letting go, IT DISCHARGED ON ITS OWN!
PSA-P320 Accidental Discharge Threads | SIG Talk Im reading about a moron who wraps a loaded firearm in a cloth and stuff it in a gym bag, and other dumb behavior that tells me the weapon isnt the problem but the user. Just 3 days ago, a Florida Corrections recruit killed herself by a negligent discharge during firearms training. Got a 40 SW P320 SC on my hip now, got one in 9mm within reach, so far neither has decided to trip the sear without my help. That wont last for long, the P320 (M17 AND M18) are already failing in the field. Note the addition of ominous background music in the second seven-minutes-longer version (there was no music in the Good Morning America version). Either the gun is defective or its not. I dont know nothing about Sigs, I do know any gunm that goes off when I lay it on a table gets sold with a warning and I never touch that brand or model again. If the gangster greed monger criminal Capitalvanians in the gun industry had their products under the jurisdiction of the consumer safety administration all the newer striker fired guns would never have been allowed on the market unless they had manual safeties and a safe take down system. 1.A rush to market, and as usual the blind greed of the gun companies who no longer test pistols before marketing them think it is cheaper (so the idiots think) to let the public test them. Thread starter ut755ln; Start date Oct 19, 2022; Forums. (It wasnt my gun). Bagnell also represented Virginia Sheriffs Deputy Marcie Vadnais who sued SIG when she said her P320 went off on its own when she was removing the weapon from her belt. Vadnais was featured in the Nightline version of ABCs report. Thats deflecting from the real issue.
P320 Accidental Discharge Still an Issue : r/SigSauer - reddit If the P320 was so great then why did special forces go to the Glock 19? No autographs, No self taken pictures. 00:03. What a wonderful parody of a MAC cultist!
Alec Baldwin fatally shoots cinematographer, injures director on set of Another p320 "accidental discharge" - The Armory Life Forum The latest of these suits was filed last week in US District Court in Massachusetts. 01:10. One hell of a conspiracy. Bagnells and other lawsuits ABC claims at least 54 discharges and 10 suits against SIG describe instances of P320s going off dating back to 2016, prior to the upgrade.
Texas Penal Code - PENAL 42.12 | FindLaw Ever since the internet went mainstream I have read about the Sigs decline. The 1911 had one added, the FN 1905 had one added in 1906. In a straight up Glock vs. Sig battle, the United States Marines chose Sig, and that was AFTER watching the P320 perform for four years. Thats the same. We will respect the ongoing investigation and will not offer further comment at this time, Bineau said. And thats just my opinion. Rather, it's because those LEO P320 pistols are seeing much more physical action than ones carried by civilians. LOL! This will include an alternate design that reduces the physical weight of the trigger, sear, and striker while additionally adding a mechanical disconnector. Too Many Accidents The safety WILL prevent the gun from firing with a trigger pull when activated, but it should never come to that. And the fact they used real models, and big ones, gives the ships a real sense of heft, mass, movement and solidity that the garbage CGI ships of the new movies just cannot remotely compete with. Ron, Is there any major military anywhere that ever issued one of their guns? The second accidental shooting happened after police supervisors internally raised questions about the safety of the SIG Sauer P320. . You should always use a real holster, or carry it condition 3 or 4 if its off-body. Heres the version that ran Tuesday morning during the networks Good Morning America program . Glock's and Sig P320 are all designated as Double-Action-Only fire control mechanisms. Sep 20, 2021 613 571 Idaho. Who function tests their firearm 1) with a round in the chamber, and 2) when its pointed at an extremity? Where is that defect now? It takes time for any new platform to work the kinks out. The cost of settlements will be passed on to us. No, it doesnt. He quickly too quickly tried to pick up the gun from the floor before anyone could see it, and in his haste, he picked it up with his finger on the trigger and accidentally fired the gun. His haste to avoid the embarrassment of his gun being seen on the floor turned the incident from a wardrobe malfunction (accidental exposure of a concealed weapon, probably just a reprimand from the OPR) into a negligent discharge (the gun being fired led to him personally getting fired!). But hey, in ruthless, lawless, Capitalvania were life is considered cheap and expendable no one gives a shit, especially the Far Right that screams about abortions and then kills off the children that were not aborted with loaded guns laying around the house. A holstered base P320 allegedly had a mysterious accidental discharge without pulling the trigger. (The defect couldnt be duplicated after the crash.). The P320s and P365s were junk, plain and simple. I carry one in my front pocket routinely. The thing is, youd probably need to generate many Gs of force in both directions simultaneously. Bagnell said he thinks the discharges are due to both design and manufacturing flaws on SIGs part. Thinking its okay to wrap a loaded gun in a towel and toss it into a gym bag is what we get when departments refuse to hire candidates who score too high on IQ tests. A fellow kept his DA revolver in the desk. Posts: 21156 | Registered: November 05, 2003. Sig Sauer P320 (Christine Peterson/TNS) February 22, 2021 Ryan Morgan Gunmaker Sig Sauer is facing a new lawsuit from a U.S. federal agent who claims his holstered P320 pistol discharged without him pulling the trigger and struck him in his upper right hip. Yes, but that did not mean the machine would be able to go on being marketed like that. Profits over reliability and you end up with junk. . Later when he was driving he shifted his weight and this caused the trigger to be pushed back further and it went off and shot him and the bullet then also blew a big hole in the floor board of this truck. Good thing you werent serious, thatd be terr..uh.oops. They didnt have to, but did. Zero in the affirmative. It sounds the same as arguing whether Captain Marvel could beat Superman up in a fist fight its pretty absurd and laughable. Sounds like these officers and others are attempting to cover their posteriors. Let us look at the history of other consumer products. It sure wasnt her fault though, because she was flooring the. The truth is the absolute WORST semi-autos that Sig, H&K, Walther, Beretta or Glock makes today are more reliable than the best semi-autos made 40 years ago, by far. The company didnt want to comment on any specific pending litigation for obvious reasons. SIG ultimately settled that lawsuit. Sig started out rough, but a lot of agencies have decided that their modular chassis system is the way of the future. Attorney Bagnell held up the law enforcement officers he represents as examples of people who are highly trained in carrying and using firearms. In my opinion, the only reason SIG would have done that is if they knew there was a safety problem with the original gun, otherwise they would not have done it., Scott says Harrison reviewed the claims in Officer Hiltons lawsuit and said, its unclear to (Harrison) what could now be causing misfires in the upgraded guns., Scott then asked Harrison if he believes the P320 should be removed from the marketplace. Now when you lose your grip on lawn mowers or snow blowers they will not keep travelling foreword all by themselves. I could care but that came at the expense of reliability and safety. So I will just continue to carry Mexican style with my striker fired polymer wonder nine from a company that may or may not be SIG. Google Keith Slatowski, is he lying also? This highly trained Fibbie was doing flips while dancing (breakdancing? Such being the case, there very well may BE in inherent design flaw in the gun; We shouldnt just cast the thought aside as being beyond consideration and insist on blaming the problem on operator error.. 1:07. (c) If conduct constituting an offense under this section also constitutes an offense under another . When a consumer product is likely to be operated in such a way that it causes accidents because it is way too easy to make a serious mistake because of human error when operating it the manufactures are told that the machine must be made safer. So your fanboy perjorative falls not only flat but false. Especially since they farm it out to the lowest bidder. Then when the gun still wouldnt operate right, field stripped it and cleared the debris, but didnt understand the gun enough to realize it was now super broken. It nicely describes what has to happen in a striker-fired P320 for an un-commanded discharge to happen as the plaintiffs have claimed. People of the Gun are probably familiar with the early problems the P320 had regarding drop safety. As for Seals they have their own contract with Glock but can carry anything they want. That took a lot. The P320 Voluntary Upgrade Program is a SIG SAUER initiative to upgrade P320 pistols at no additional cost . Then without any extra effort, the normal trigger pull caused the tab on the drop safety to sheer off. Even if it was an issue with the sear interface, there is still a firing pin safety that will not move unless the trigger is held firmly to the rear. Yes, its reliable, but no more so than most other major brands well known models. And it doesnt take too much Googling to find plenty of reports of LEOs suing the Georgia company as well (see here, here, here, and here for just a few). Unless they have to fire their weapon in an on-duty incident most officers only fire their weapons just before and/or at qualifications, which depending on the department are annual or semi-annual. Bineau added the review is looking at so-called ancillary equipment (meaning the holster and other items) as one element of that broader investigation. in Capitalvania. Ron Cohen ruined Kimber and now hes doing the same to SIG. (unless theyre SWAT or something). Asking for a friend. A fine of up to $10,000. Its pathetic how often these legal stunts work. Search Texas Statutes. And on the flip side of the coin is the decades of denial by Remington on the 700 which Ive seen firsthand. If this were a car, a phone, a refrigerator, it would have been recalled long ago. The best take on this subject is by the author himself: this is about slime lawyers looking to build a national narrative and get a few wins in, so they can more easily get the next win and the next one, the next one and so on. Pity that some of the most common reactions fall into two over simplistic categories: 1. Remember also that with a handful of notable exceptions, modern firearms do not just go off, no matter what is later claimed by those who may be held responsible. 2. Without a loser pays tort system, such abuse will go on and on.
SIG SAUER Statement on CANSOFCOM Incident - Soldier Systems Daily They cant even make claim to doing a twice a year qual. Its also interesting that theres apparently no corresponding flood of civilian lawsuits against SIG with similar claims of guns going off, even though the public owns far more P320s than do law enforcement agencies. JTF-2 is the only unit in. The Hide Armory. Harrison stated that, I have not seen enough to convince me that the upgraded version is dangerous., When ABCs David Scott asked Harrison if its a mystery whats going wrong with the updated version though Harrison had just stated the upgraded pistol isnt dangerous Harrison said, I do not have an explanation for why the updated version should have complaints from trained individuals. Circumstances that explained those un-commanded discharges..
Sig Sauer P320: The US Army Loves This Gun (But There Is a Problem) The round went downrange so nobody was hurt. Or you would have to have enough slide play for the slide movement to physically disengage the sear and striker leg mating surfaces. 3) If the sear fails, there is the drop safety in the way of the striker. ! while being accompanied by some form of obvious stupidity like putting an unholstered gun in a gym bag with other stuff. Trying to categorically say Brand X is better than Brand Y!
Special Forces pistol discharge not caused by technical failure They have hundreds of thousands of P320s in regular service now and, despite a search, we couldnt find a rash of reports of soldiers claiming their pistols are firing on their own. There are several stories about her in the news for various no reasons, she must be throwing them out by a dozen. Manual safeties on pistols, hammer and striker fired systems were found necessary as far back as 1900. 3. Finger on the trigger and muzzle discipline are sometimes unheralded. Oct 20, 2022 #36 ; vh20 said: . The Glocks lack of a manual safety has caused untold thousands of needless cripplings and death. The pistol is popular with commercial gun owners and law enforcement south of the border. My dad owned one and that is exactly what happened one time when he was using it. Where is this lightning striking twice? I wouldnt be surprised if she did it intentionally, she clearly suffers from a serious case of media whoring. Have heard of no issues like the alleged gremlin caused spontaneous discharges of the P320 in other Sig models. Happy with my old S&W revolvers, 3rd Gen S&W pistols,1911s and a slew of P226s. Stinking Lawyers and quota cops. Theres just too much other paraphernalia bouncing around in there. Sig makes a damn fine weapon and theres nothing wrong with it. I still own them all. 19 Feb 2021 Military.com | By Matthew Cox A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 -- a pistol. All those customers who paid $1600 now had a limited function paper weight.
Another p320 "accidental discharge" - The Armory Life Forum SIG doesnt so you get killed by a punk with a Hi Point. So does any of this mean theres something wrong with the P320? You clanging a bell that went silent years ago. And they would not have done that for no reason at all. Glock is being sued too, because once loaded and a round is chambered, it also has a much lighter trigger than a DA/SA. Keep your finger off the trigger unless you are ready to shoot. Hilton has filed a $15 million lawsuit alleging the P320 has a serious design and manufacturing flaw. If its not legal momentum, it would have to be some other mechanism of failure.. Dont quote the four rules of safety in your article when all the hotness in the gun world is appendix carry pointing something at an extremity and the photos you use showing front slide serrationsputting your hands fingers near the business end of the barrel, because press checks from the front is the way all the cool operator guys do it. I just separate Shatner the man from Kirk the character, which he plays with Shakespearian operatic perfection. Sig can burn for all I care. For instance theres Lieutenant Thomas Ahern who was was performing a routine function (test) of his P320 when it fired at him without any force towards the trigger, resulting in the bullet impacting his left thigh.. These cops seem pretty dang stupid if they put loaded guns in gym bags and purses with other stuff and carry them around, especially a gun that lacks manual safeties. If these same folks were around in the 80s and got their way, no one today would know what a Glock was. The claim basically boils down to the notion that in normal, unconcerning operation, a foreign body entered the striker body. If the military was going to go cheap then they should have thrown Taurus into the mix.
Marine vet ICE agent sues Sig Sauer for $10M claiming pistol shot him Mine is very accurate. Everyone remembers the problems the Beretta M9 had, but it got sorted and they went on to serve over 30 years. Its a novelty, its got issues! I wish nothing bad on anyone carrying regardless of brand. After watching a friend get killed by a Remington 700 by another friend and the ensuing fallout 31 years ago I decided that I didnt care if the P320 was fixed, it was getting sold. Hey, Im sitting here staring at my P320, waiting for it to go bang! 3. He wanted to see how accurate the gun was, especially after the customer got it back after the voluntary upgrade. Not only is it now the designated sidearm of all branches of the U.S. military, there are over a million of them in civilian hands. There was no holster involved. It alleges that Walter Collette, Jr., a police officer with the Somerville (Mass.) I dont own a P320. Covid ruined that gravy train for him but hes still doing the conventions. Liberal, Conservative. If the latter were to occur, the drop safety would prevent discharge because it would not be pushed up by anything. Lastly, ship-wise I have to go with the TMP-era refit Enterprise, regardless of Captain. I sold that pistol when I got it back. Both versions of the ABC report included comments from Officer Hiltons attorney, Jeffrey Bagnell, who said, Its not credible to claim that people with this amount of training, this amount of skill are all shooting themselves. He was told to shoot two rounds. He was told to shoot two rounds. Combine this with the complacency that comes with handling a firearm over-and-over again as you holster and unholster a firearm throughout the day, its not surprising that many of these officers are saying it just went off as a negligent discharge can cost them their job if it lead to serious injury or property damage. The networks report didnt mention lawsuits filed by LEOs (or anyone else) against other gun makers claiming similar alleged design defects. But Shatner? The incident with the P320 - a contender for a major Canadian Armed Forces procurement of thousands of pistols and holsters that has a Aug. 3 deadline for industry proposals - occurred at JTF-2's Dwyer Hill training range just west of Ottawa. Clients such as law enforcement officers whose negligent discharges could result in their being disciplined or fired unless it can be proven that the gun was at fault. Once word of that got out there was an avalanche of sexual harassment lawsuits against Fox news. . The Glock fails on both counts. (a) A person commits an offense if the person recklessly discharges a firearm inside the corporate limits of a municipality having a population of 100,000 or more. Dont care for them, not my jam. I know off body carry is a recipe for disaster. What it likely means is that cops and other law enforcement officers carry and handle their guns far more often than the average Joe or Jane. Some of the plaintiffs claim the pistol can fire without the trigger even being touched. They admitted their problem and fixed it. I would rather play handball with the Devil himself because if you deal with the Devil he will tell you that you agreed to lose your soul for a big box full of millions in cash. selling the 365 with strikers breaking?
SEPTA officer's handgun spontaneously fired in Philly's Suburban Station There was nothing wrong with the Glock action, it was a training issue. 2) The p320 does have a half cocked notch. My bet would be that someone had a fully loaded gun in a gym bag and a cloth or rag snagged the trigger. UPDATE:We were just made aware of YouTuber BoomStick Tactical who produced this video the day before our post published. Canadian soldier. They function as commanded every time. He said there has to be something wrong with the gun if this is happening to individuals with this amount of training, this amount of skill.. Charlton, headquartered in Victoria, B.C., for comment on its original story, but neither responded. Sig Sauer's P320 is widely used by police departments across the country, and is a big seller in the civilian market, with about half a million sold nationwide. Instead we see a Sig that is ran by Mr. Cohen of Kimber fame have repeated quality and product development failures. I lost $200 on a gun that had less then 1000 rounds through it but I could care. They are being replaced with Glocks. Second, pardon us if were more than a little skeptical that the P320 in question or any other handgun fired when it was out of battery. While good firearms training and practices among law enforcement officers is certainly the case much of the time, weve seen far too many instances over the years of un-safe or downright dangerous practices by allegedly highly trained individuals to apply that kind of blanket endorsement to all cops or alphabet agency employees. If you want to find the lowest form of life on the planet interview any C.E.O. Maybe in South America a poor military did, but thatd be about it.
Special Forces pulls new pistols from service after soldier - CBC Sig Sauer P320 [Review+Video]: Worth It? - Pew Pew Tactical So if, say, a person was to accidentally get shot through no fault of their own and need to sue, which specific cartridge/appendage combo would yield the most favorable least pain/permanent-damage : highest-payout ratio? Yaaay! With the redesign, you would have to implement a LOT of force to move the trigger backwards. Bravo. Again the Far Right Stupidity and hypocrisy is infinite. who sells them? Fact is most SF carry what they want and the Marine Recon I know very well who has friends in that community told me many in the Navy NSW program still carry the Mk 25, they don want a striker fired pistol that can hydrolock in water. RKC, the first time someone presented me with a 1911 whose trigger rivaled my Pythons single action, I started wondering about that. Bagnell told TTAG that he believes the problem with the striker-fired P320 is an inadequate sear/striker connection (he has images he says illustrate this on his website). The guys at the LGS saw only one broken striker but it confirmed what the manager who had the P320 go off and my thoughts. The heads up testing was immediately finished the Sig was the winner. Sig, take this firearm off the market, and recall. Not much detail is provided in any of those other claimed incidents, but a few stand out. Id read that for TMP, they got NASA to help in the design of the refit Enterprise. But then Im not a federal LE flunky who cant keep my booger hook off the bang switch, either. The fact that Shatner was doing Wrath of Kahn meet and greets at 90 years old kind of soured me.